Look mum, no hand! v0.5

Shiiuga 1193

I've taken stock of this idea over the last few days and I think it might actually be a good one. Cybernetics Division: Humanity Upgraded decks have been coming out of the woodwork recently, and I've seen some really interesting variations, some of which I've incorporated aspects of in to my deck. Additionally, there were a number of very helpful comments on v0.1, so thanks guys.

Agendas

The agenda suite has been totally overhauled. I think that Self-Destruct Chips was a nice idea but it would be difficult to achieve practically. You want to encourage people to run your server o'doom, and if you're just blank installing cards in it it's probably not worth their while. So, for the sake of deck size they were cut.

Executive Retreat was a terrible idea and Project Wotan is redundant now I've removed most bioroid ice, so Priority Requisition is in for some nice NEXT synergy, and then the Fragments, which all have potential benefits join them.

Assets

I don't think an Asset economy suits this deck particularly well. Sure, you have a big impenetrable server, but you have other plans for that. So, Adonis Campaign is gone in favour of more burst econ. I dropped the Jackson Howards as well as Chairman Hiro puts such a tax on your influence. I can get cards out another way if needs be. Cerebral Overwriter goes in to the biggy if you think you can trick the runner in to thinking it's a 5/3. At the least it'll put the willies right up them if they see it.

Upgrades

Research Station for increased handisze to help combat Nerve Agents, Legworks and HQ Interfaces. Still 2x Self-destruct to protect Hiro as a last resort. Dropped one Valley Grid (again to free up influence) and Ash 2X3ZB9CY and Awakening Center are out.

Ryon Knight comes in to punish the runner for running last click. He's another candidate for Architect. I can only imagine it being hilarious. Finally, I think Shell Corporation might be a great econ engine in this deck. Put it behind a couple of bits of ICE and rez Valley Grid with it and watch the Nope train come in to Not On Your Nelly station.

Operations

Dropped an Interns for the card slot. Green Level Clearance for econ and a bit of a draw engine. I thought about Blue Level Clearance but with the possibility of playing with a reduced hand size for a lot of the game it seemed like overdraw.

Archived Memories in case you need to pull Interns out of archives, or if you have to play Hiro from hand because your architect keeps getting broken.

Neural EMP, which is a great call, goes in to provide a killing blow if the runner goes down to 0 hand size and ends their turn.

ICE

Like the agendas, the ICE has been completely repurposed.

Most of the bioroids are gone. Heimdall 1.0 was counterproductive and I think NEXT ice synergises really well with the idea behind this deck. A timely NEXT Gold rez could be a game winner, and again, it's the damned if you do, damned if you don't thing that I like about it.

Someone suggested Fenris but I think Viktor 2.0 is better because for 1 extra credit you don't have to wear the bad pub for the rest of the game.

I had Pop-up Window in for a while but I switched it out for Errand Boy because it's more taxing to the runner. A lot of the time people just let Errand Boy fire, and if not they're spending 3 minimum to stop you from gaining money. Also works as a nice draw engine if you're about to be legworked.

Gyri Labyrinth is obviously the foundation upon which your ultimate server of ultimate death is built.

The plan is simple. Reduce the hand size so much by creating such a taxing server that a Hiro rez will kill them at the end of their turn. Use Valley Grid, Gyri Labyrinth, Ryon Knight and Architect to achieve this.

If Hiro isn't a possibility, get them down to 0 hand size and then Neural EMP them.

If they're reluctant to run, score out. If they manage to steal an agenda from the sever, believe me it'll be worth it.

The deck is still quite poor. The problem with the reduced deck size is the lack of slots for econ cards. I'm almost tempted to add a 2 point agenda and take it up to 46/47 cards, but that's anathema to me in a 40/15 ID.

Thoughts, fan letters and glowing tributes as always very welcome.

15 comments
22 May 2015 unitled

"...watch the Nope train come in to Not On Your Nelly station"

I'm going to have to use this phrase way more in everyday life.

I think going for the negative hand flatline is a really good idea in this deck, I'm waiting to see how effective Hiro is before I go down that route, though... Maybe with something like Tech Startup he could be good? I've also grabbed a Successful Demonstration to use in my decklist for this ID, I've been trying to keep it at least semi-thematic, and 2 to gain 7 is just amazing.

Really interested to hear how you get on with this!

22 May 2015 gandrasch

Biggest concern I have is that all decks play parasite nowadays, which messes with valley grid a lot.

22 May 2015 Shiiuga

@unitled Someone mentioned Tech Startup in the previous version but I feel it ruins the surprise if the runner knows what's coming ;)

@gandrasch yeah, Parasite is a problem, not gonna lie. Guess you just keep replacing the ICE.

22 May 2015 Shannon.L

The more I watch your take on this identity, the more it's influencing my own.

I need to know how you envision Hiro as the kill; I've been playing for a while, but I'm not seeing how he can bring closure the way you imply. As best I can tell, the runner's hand size can't be reduced below zero; hand size reduction isn't damage.

The thing I struggle with is econ - yours is strong. It's intriguing - but I'm going to say I think the idea of 'taxing' ice is a bad one for this ID and concept. You never, ever want a piece of ICE the runner doesn't have to fully break; if he gives you even a single card or credit for errand boy, you don't get the Valley's draining effect.

The other dangerous thing seems to be the removal of Self-Destruct Chips. Here's the thing:

  • One scored Self-Destruct Chip means the runner only has to hit 3 ice to drain completely.
  • Two scored Self-Destruct Chips... two ice.
  • Three.. one ICE.

In your deck, with the Chairman, you'll essentially kill the runner by letting the runner do his thing, waiting for a moment when he reduces his own hand size to two or less. Then, rez Hiro at the end of his turn (before his discard), and Neural EMP at the start of yours. Chips or Brain Damage lets you simply choose when you'll have that opportunity.

Also, self-destruct is a virtual guaranteed kill on a large-ice server, if circumstances are right. If you can force the net damage over a broken hand, the Runner's dead.

Aaaanyway - and apologies for the ramble, as I'm in and out as I'm at work today - I think your agendas aren't quite right. You look like you want Self-Destruct Chips (because seriously, they're mean and scorable), False Lead to kick on your Ryan Knight, and Vitruvius to aid in your archive digging (or just to score a quick 3/2). The Shards are great, but I'm not sure they're giving your deck any punch, and with such a low card count, every card has to matter.

... though Hades could be nasty, if only because it'll ensure you can't easily be decked through time alone.

Anyway - just random thoughts. I need to look hard at mine again, and figure out this econ thing.

22 May 2015 unitled

@Shannon.L Negative hand size will kill the runner at the end of their turn when they need to discard down below zero. That's one of the ways brain damage kills runners, should be in the rules somewhere :-)

22 May 2015 FarCryFromHuman

You'll find the same discussion on a lot of Cybernetics deck comments, but the runner's hand size can be negative, and does cause a flatline. It's in the official rules somewhere.

22 May 2015 Shiiuga

@Shannon.L I totally see what you're saying about the agendas but the problem is just as you say, every card is at a premium. It might turn out like you say that being able to score out a 3/1 3/2 might be vital, but right now I'm struggling a lot for space and losing two cards is a big factor.

22 May 2015 Shannon.L

Whuff - that's... truly brutal. I was building my variant on the assumption that it couldn't drop below zero; that certainly changes things.

You do realize that it makes servers with two ice and a valley completely locked against a runner with a hand size of one, for whatever reason? That's... utterly nasty.

22 May 2015 Shiiuga

Incidentally successful demonstration is a great idea.

22 May 2015 unitled

I've tried to focus on ice with ALL nasty subs, my deck is over here: netrunnerdb.com

And yes, Valley Grid can be brutal. I had a game out of Biotech where I had three ice and VG on RnD and three ice and VG on my remote. I had the two damage ID and the runner had a point of brain damage. There was basically no way they could get into either server without me killing them the turn after!

22 May 2015 Heartthrob

I used to use Gyri in a CI Scorch deck. It resulted in being no more than a 0/1-credit speed bump for most runners. There's no real way to get that subroutine to fire when it really matters.

22 May 2015 DrunkenGineer

Tech Startup is best with an asset that you want on your turn but don't want to risk getting trashed before you can use. Thus, it's best with Director Haas (who comes into effect immediately), but not really great with Chairman Hiro (who the runner has a full turn to stare down before he takes effect).

23 May 2015 Shiiuga

@Heartthrob gyri works well here because of course they're never going to let it fire. You might be able to corporate troubleshooting it, but voluntarily they will always take the -1 hand size from breaking over letting it fire. It's a psychological thing. Probably. I've not tested it yet.

@DrunkenGineer agreed. It's just telegraphing it and giving the runner time to prepare for it.

1 Jun 2015 lajcik

I fear Gyri Labyrinth might be a lost cause now that Net-Ready Eyes will make Yog.0 a thing again. People will just break it for 0 because they can. Also, it doesn't help you protect your centrals and is useless without Valley Grid behind it. I tried playing it in Jinteki Biotech and it was pretty bad, it's strength is just too low to matter :(

Anyway, i really like the approach :) Will try that tomorrow with a slightly modified ICE suite.

1 Jun 2015 Shiiuga

Yeah, in the updated version (http://netrunnerdb.com/en/decklist/21438/look-mum-no-hand-v0-9) Gyri was gone for that very reason.