Rielle Talk 3.0

Please forgive the newbie question, but with Lady, you only get to break a barrier ICE 4 times (2 subs per), 8 with clone chip, for the entire game. If someone throws two barriers on a remote, how do you sustain that? Seems you'll burn through your counters and then be locked out forever.

Disregard. I just re-read and saw your comment about Scavenge. I didn't even consider that you can use that card to trash a card to pay for playing itself again.

I think this is one of the best Stealth Kit decks I've seen, as it doesn't bother messing around with Dagger or BlacKat, and seems to have a good mix of stealth cards and various ways to get them out. Leprechaun in particular is a great piece of tech. A few questions though:

How does this play with zero Replicators? Is the 2 Diesel enough to draw into your non-tutorables? Do you feel at all hindered by the inability to run Silencers like the Kate stealth decks do? How does 3x R&D Interface play compared to 3x TME?

@Myth: Yes, Scavenge is amazing for refueling programs with Power Counters. Keep in mind that this works with D4VID, Overmind, Imp, etc.

I'd also respond that even if I didn't have as many Scavenges in the deck, Kit will be using her decoder the majority of the time. A lot of Barriers she runs into will be Code Gates, and with the stealth Rig, it's much more efficient to break with Refractor. The exception is probably Eli1.0, which Lady destroys.

@spiralshadow: Thanks! Early versions of this deck definitely had BlacKat and Dagger. I had BlacKat in this deck during Worlds and I'd say that was my biggest regret; that breaker just does more harm than good. Switchblade was an easy substitute once it came out. Sure, Dagger is in faction, but Switchblade is a guaranteed break on nearly every Sentry if you have two stealth credits. Switchblade is worth the 2 influence, hands down.

To answer your question, I've messed around with Replicators, but, honestly, it's hard to justify the card slots for them. This deck is more of a pseudo Big Rig; you really shouldn't be spending a lot of your time setting up. Once you have a Refractor and a single stealth credit, run hard! Kit has the best early game advantage out of all the other Runners.

This deck is also efficient without a lot of set-up. Refractor + Stealth Credit source is a whopping 2 credit investment. And now Code Siphon helps you set up your Rig even faster, since you can easily blow through 1 layer of ICE and use the discount on Code Siphon to bust out a Magnum Opus. Overall the Replicators just aren't needed; they are nice, but it's hard to justify 2-3 card slots for them when this deck runs just fine early, mid, and late game.

2 Diesel seems to be the right amount. Keep in mind Astrolabe can be a game changer against the most meta heavy factions at the moment (NEH, RP, PE). You will be Clicking for some card draw, but this deck is very flexible. There's never one piece of the puzzle you absolutely need. You can usually run just fine with what you got.

The lack of Silencers isn't a problem for Kit, because she turns so many of those tiny Sentries into code gates anyways. Between Cloak and Ghost Runner, that's enough to pump Switchblade for the entire game (especially now that BlacKat is out of the picture). I use Lockpick the most though, since I'm using my decoder every single run. If Sentries become a huge problem against a Jinteki player or something, tutor for the Parasite and blow it up.

My next version of this deck will contain Spooned and Same Old Thing in favor of Parasites once Order and Chaos comes out. Spooned is going to turn Kit into a monster.

I like R&D Interface because it's consistent. Yes, the Corp is going to overprotect R&D (you're a Shaper, so they were going to do that anyways), but since Kit can get in so often, she'll make far more than 3 runs on R&D the whole game. I'd rather deep dig R&D 6-7 times than just 3 because I ran out of Maker's Eyes. And, you have the benefit of them underprotecting HQ, making a surprise Legwork run extra stellar. I won a few games at Worlds with the earlier version of this deck thanks to some clutch Legwork runs alone.

Thanks for answering all my questions! You seem to know the ins and outs of this deck quite thoroughly. Are there any particular weaknesses you've noticed?

I definitely know the deck thoroughly. I've been playing Kit almost since she was released, so I've watched her go from mediocre to awesome as new cards and tools have come out. This deck has changed a lot since it's 1.0 version, which wasn't even a Stealth variant yet. It's interesting looking at the changes I've made along the way due to playtesting and tweaking.

The biggest weakness for any Kit deck has always been her 10 influence. It's much less of an issue now than it was when Creation & Control came out and the card pool was so limited. But even thinking towards the future with Order & Chaos and adding Spooned to this deck (3 influence a pop!) I'm going to need to give up Legworks or Switchblade to make it work...and it's difficult to make those sacrifices.

Weaknesses in this deck specifically is making multiple runs in a single turn. Not only is Kit's ability used up on the second run, but a lot of your recurring stealth credits are probably spent as well. This deck is catered towards one big run per turn rather than a series of aggressive little runs. Another weakness would be the inconsistency of Astrolabe against certain matchups. It's never really a waste, since 1 credit for 1 MU is always nice. But a Corp that installs one big remote and nothing else can easily hinder your card draw. But I see Astrolabe as more "icing on the cake" rather than a reliable draw engine. I was looking at Collective Consciousness, but that has the same issues with reliability and also takes up precious MU. It's probably a good card in some decks, but I don't see it fitting in this one.

What's your opening first few turns? Not specifically what actions, but what is your goal by about turn 3? Let's assume you get a mediocre draw to start with. Do you go digging for a leprachaun and tutor a magnum, then click Magnum a few turns? How do you get your economy going?

Or do you instead go for a refractor right off the bat and start face checking servers? If so, how do you bankroll this? Seems you might get off a couple runs or so, but then the ice starts to appear and you've bled what few credits you have and now need to spend some turns getting built back up?

Basically, can you just summarize what your opening strategy/guidelines might be with this?

Thanks so much!

Openings certainly depend on your opponent's Corp ID, but I'll give you my general gameplan.

A solid opening hand has Refractor (or SMC) and a Stealth Credit. The probability of this happening is pretty high and most of the games I've played have gotten this either on the first hand or the mulligan. My first turn then is basically install Refractor for 1, install Stealth for 1, and run on Click 3. Now, your opponent knows that you can get in anywhere, so they may not even rez, which is fine. The biggest problem for Refractor is Eli1.0 since it cost a stealth credit and 2 bucks to get through. If they rez an Eli1.0 on turn 1, I just bounce; they're behind 3 credits and that's fine. That's essentially your gameplan. Early pressure.

If you're playing it right, you'll be a bit on the poor side, but the Corp will be as well; keeping Kit out AND needing to double ICE all of their servers is an expensive endeavor. Remember, they need to rez the second layer of ICE as well, since your ability only triggers on an encounter. Honestly, by turn 2 or 3, it's not uncommon to have 4 rezzed ICE on the table (2 on R&D, 2 on HQ) and that means the Corp is extremely broke. This gives you adequate time to set up the other pieces of your Stealth Rig.

Now, let's say you mulligan into a terrible hand. I'd spend at least Clicks 1 and 2 drawing to see if you can turn that around. By Click 3, I'd definitely make a rigless run. Of course, that depends on your opponent. Against Jinteki, you don't want to hit a Komainu with a full hand of cards (it's happened to me more times than I'd like to admit). Against NEH, I'd just spend the entire turn running, since you know their ICE is mostly going to be End the Run. Might as well make them spend money early on.

By turn 3, I'd like to have my Refractor at least in-hand with at least 3-4 runs under my belt. Even if you're not accessing, as long as the Corp is rezzing ICE, you'll be fine. Economy really isn't as big of an issue as you'd think. Refractor costs 1, stealth credit sources cost 1, and a single stealth credit will get your Refractor to 5 Strength. With that, unless they're rezzing Tollbooths in your face, you can run with very little money at least for the first few turns. Hopefully with some moderate drawing, you'll be able to get an Opus or Kati, with some Sure Gambles in between.

I never dig for a Leprechaun. It's awesome to get one early on, but that's what the Scavenge x3 is for; so you can install stuff immediately and worry about moving it onto the Leprechaun later. Scavenge adds a ton of flexibility for that reason. Honestly, I'd only tutor a Magnum if I had a Code Siphon and got the 3 credit discount from the first piece of ICE. Nice thing is, Kit can get through 1 piece of ICE no problem. I have Test Run'd for a Magnum a few times, but you usually use your whole turn doing so (Click 1 Test Run, Click 2-4 Gain six credits with Opus, next turn install Opus).

I've won plenty of games where Opus never hits the field. Between Kati, Opus, Sure Gambles, and recurring credits, economy is rarely an issue and you can be flexible with it. And while you definitely don't need both Opus and Kati, it's extremely nice to be able to Opus as you need it all while building a nice savings on Kati for a big Legwork run later.

Great write-up, very helpful to me understanding the thought that goes into the opening turns! I'll certainly be giving this deck a try this week. Thanks for the help!

Do you think a Dagger/Spooned build would be better than a Switchblade/Legwork build? Switchblade is way better than Dagger to be sure, but I feel like the pure destructive power of Spooned would be enough to justify having to pool a couple more credits to bust sentries with Dagger.

Tried this deck a couple of times, but I'm having trouble with Draw power and also feeling kind of slow. Also, not really feeling the Code Siphon's, it's nice to have another tutor, but without anything in the deck that gets benefits from successful runs, it just feels like a spendy endeavor. In my first match against RP, he had 2 ice on HQ, R&D and a remote before I even had a replicator to start running. The second was vs Weilland GRLND and though I did manage to get in quicker, R&D ended up having 2 Archers, so going in just for a code Siphon seemed unwise to say the least. Also, a bit weary of just having Lady as my only barrier breaker... Any suggestions?

@razhemnet I'm running a pretty similar Kit deck with Personal Workshop and Stimhack. Yes, the deck can be a bit slow sometimes, but you just have to put the pressure on the Corp early.

Against RP you need to Parasite the ICE right away. But then again I have 3 Clone Chips to help me with that. I haven't tried Code Siphon, but I don't really need another tutor and R&D is heavily protected against . If there is 2 Archers on R&D I wouldn't use Code Siphon either. Any deck will have some problems with 2 stacked Archers and with this deck you'll run out of Stealth Credits as you need to use Credits from Ghost Runner. But that's where Parasite comes and saves the day! And Femme Fatale works for Archer as well.

I've tried Cerberus "Lady" H1 as my only Fracter as well (only 1 copy) and it's been working fine. I don't even have Scavenge in my deck. If playing against Blue Sun: Powering the Future I can't really use Parasites, so my Clone Chips are used to recycle the Lady when needed. You might want to give Crescentus a try.

Oh and if you are completely locked out of R&D, you can just Click for with Magnum Opus and wait for them to put something in their Scoring Remote. Weyland doesn't have many/any tricks for Fast Advance. So -2 Code Siphon +1 Test Run and +1 whatever you feel you need the most (card draw seemed to be your biggest issue so maybe +1 Diesel)

@razhemnet I've playd it a few times and the draw power doesn't seem to be an issue with me. All you really need to get started is a single stealth credit and refractor - or a way to get refractor. And with all the ways of fetching cards, you should be able to get refractor right away. Once you have that, you can put the pressure on corp early, forcing them to ICE up and get credits to rez the ice. Hit them once or twice a turn to keep the pressure on while you spend the other 2 or 3 clicks building your deck up. By the time they finally have double iced everything of importance and rezzed at least one ICE on each of them, you should have another way to fetch your next breaker, and hopefully a few credits. Just my experience from a handful of games though.

Sorry for the late replies. Here we go.

@spiralshadow: I won't know for sure until playtesting and I don't play on OCTGN. But, at least in theory, you wouldn't using your Switchblade as consistently, since you'd be turning a lot of the sentries into Code Gates and Spooning them. I like Switchblade a lot more than Dagger, but Dagger certainly isn't bad and saves you on Stealth credits. Overall, I think the changes will be hard to speculate on and it will certainly depend on the matchup.

@razhemnet: The deck would be very slow with any other Identity, but with Kit, since her early game is so brutal on the Corp, it balances out. You can apply early aggression while setting up your Rig. It sounds like you were keeping (or just getting unlucky with) some pretty bad opening hands. The one thing I love about this deck is that it's pretty consistent. If I don't have a Refractor in my opening hand, or at LEAST an SMC, I usually mulligan. Keep in mind that you don't need a Rig to run either. As long as you're making the Corp rez, you'll be keeping up with them. But honestly, a single credit to install a Refractor will guarantee you get through any 2 strength ICE.

Keep in mind that the Corp is going to be double stacking centrals very early against Kit. You just need to use that to your advantage. Run often, even without a Rig and make them rez to keep you out. If you take a few net damage in the process, no big deal.

Code Siphon is mostly there for your Magnum Opus, your Lady, or your Switchblade. With a single piece of ICE on the server, that 3 credit discount is huge. And keep in mind, you get the discount whether they rez or not. That inherently gives Code Siphon great a great pressure ability. As far as Lady as the only fracter, I'd say it's the best non-influence alternative. There is no way in hell I can spare the influence in Kit for Corroder, Battering Ram is too beefy for this deck, and Inti just doesn't have the power to get through the problematic barriers efficiently (Eli, Hive, etc). Lady is very efficient, getting through Eli for a single buck, it's in faction, it can be recurred with Scavenge, AND most of Kit's barrier encounters are going to turn into Code Gates anyways. Hope that answers some of your concerns.

@Myth: Yup, that's exactly the strategy :) This deck has amazing opening hands since there are 3 Refractors and so many tutors, plus 9 different sources of stealth credits. The odds are fairly in your favor to start with 1 Refractor (or tutor) and 1 stealth credit. 1 credit for a Refractor and 1 credit for a stealth chip will get you access Anywhere on turn one. That kind of pressure is just insane. The rest of the Rig is pretty cheap to set up, except maybe the R&D interfaces. But there's not much you can do about that.