Help a Baby Invasive Predator!

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scd 190

Now that Data & Destiny is up, I thought I'd share a basically untested Apex deck, just to get ideas on where we might take this weird and interesting ID. Here's my basic Apex that I've been tinkering with over the past week, since Gen Con:

Chop Bot 3000 + the Apex ability means choosing between fueling up with an facedown installation each turn or, essentially, discarding a card for a clickless draw. This ... sort of works? I think?

The rest of the influence is spread out on a bunch of stuff, from a Levy AR Lab Access, since you'll be churning through your deck, some cheap draw (the Diesels), and multi-access (a single Legwork, a single Medium for now).

Money is a big problem for Apex. It's pretty much all burst econ right now (with the exception of Wasteland), as a successful Apocalypse means any Data Folding, Magnum Opus, etc. would be turned into a facedown card and thus not worth the install cost. Same with why I've decided not to include any Interfaces nor e3 Feedback Implants, which some have discussed as useful here. So, right now, this deck has any and all burst econ choices, from the good to the mediocre.

Overmind is in here to break anything you really need to break that's not Endless Hungerable, but might be cuttable (the timing sucks, you'd have to get it installed before the Endless Hunger). I've got a single Sharpshooter, just in case I run into something very nasty. I'd initially thought about including Deus X, as an Apocalypse with a Hostile Insfrastructure on the table initially looked like a huge burst of net damage that Apex should be scared of, but I was wrong -- based on the Singularity ruling, the HIs would trigger a single net damage for each card in succession, so the Deus X isn't useful to protect against this after all.

Also, while I initially thought Datasuckers would be an autoinclude with Prey, note the wording ("when you pass"), which means that any reduction of strength from the suckers goes away post-encounter. And, at one point, I was flirting with a Leprechaun setup and then a Scheherazade attempt, with Mopus and Endless Hunger, freeing up MU for Overminds, etc. Neither felt like it was going to work, as the one thing I'm learning is that you do not "build a rig" with Apex -- it all gets churned with any successful Apocalypse. Oh well.

Anyway, I've tried a couple variants of this deck... and it clearly doesn't work reliably yet. But, in service of getting people talking more about how to make Apex viable, here's at least one possible starting point.

Please post ideas, criticisms, and Apex fan art below. Let's help baby Apex grow up into a fearsome and mature ball of cybertentacles.

9 comments
10 Aug 2015 SPECPOL

From my play testing with APEX thus far, card draw and econ are the biggest problems, just like you said. Chopbot has helped, and I have flirted with including Adam's Safety First directive. Instead of Overmind I have had real success with Faust, since the timing doesn't matter as much. Apocalypse has been cut down to a 1x- it's either too difficult to pull off or I can do it late game but it won't have enough impact.

A cool combination is prey/kraken. You can really destroy server defenses.

I am running a single LARLA, though I am considering dropping it- I have yet to deck out, even running super aggressively.

DDoS from the Universe of Tomorrow has been a clutch card in a game or two, but it's high influence cost (and cost to play) has been rough.

I have also been toying with a Leprechaun/Keyhole/Magnum Opus build, since access is typically just not a problem. A 1x of Hades shard helps too.

This build looks fun. I think to really get the most out of APEX we need to stop thinking about traditional rigs and runner setups- when you run as APEX you play APEX's game, APEX doesn't play your game. Good Luck!

10 Aug 2015 scd

Thanks! And, yeah, I've also thought about Adam's Safety First as well -- it could be interesting. Faust, I hadn't considered, but if I'm churning through cards both installed and in hand, I might consider throwing in a second Levy University. Also, the version I posted here lacks Clone Chips or any kind of recursion beyond the Levy, and I might want some of that, too. But I'm beginning to think that Levy is the answer here -- not thinking about trying to pull programs out of the trash, but just going for more deck churn. It's a weird ID!

10 Aug 2015 FarCryFromHuman

You choose the order the corp cards are trashed in, so you can just trash Hostile Infrastructure first for a single net. If it's not rezzed, there's no action window after you play Apocalypse, so you can trash everything without fear.

10 Aug 2015 scd

Alas, that's what I'd hoped, but that's not the case based on the Singularity ruling -- I had a discussion with ANCUR about this on Twitter the other day. #Apocalypse trashes everything simultaneously, so the HI effects apply to each card, in succession. So, if the Corp has 8 cards out that you trash with the Apocalypse, that means you have 8 successive net damages that hit you. And since they're all triggering at once (though somehow in succession?), then you get hit with 8 individual net damages, meaning the Deus X isn't going to help you much.

10 Aug 2015 scd

"In succession" is misleading, as it seem to imply an order that the Runner can choose -- that's not the case. I should have just said "separate" as they're all simultaneous net damages. You can use Deus X to protect against any one net damage, but the others are still going to hit.

10 Aug 2015 SPECPOL

I don't think the Hostile Infrastructure issue is that big- Hearbeat can protect you, except in extreme cases. You could always go to trash HI the turn before apocalypse anyway, and I doubt it would telegraph, since most aggressive runners move to trash HI immediately. Honestly, the only thing that has given me pause as APEX are destroyer subroutines. Losing Endless Hunger is the only surefire way you will stall out. I keep a 2nd copy in hand for as long as I can.

10 Aug 2015 scd

No, me either, it gave me pause at first but it's really not as big of a deal. What I'm most concerned about, though, is econ -- more specifically, being able to trash assets, steal NAPDs (no Film Critics allowed in Apex), etc. Anyone considered throwing an Imp or two in here?

10 Aug 2015 TheWackyWombat

I would cut Overmind just based on the cost of Endless Hunger. Unless Overmind hits the field first, the 4 MU cost on Endless doesnt leave anything for power counters.

I'd also consider including some recursion like Clone Chip. Although Apex will keep going through the Corps barriers, a single 'Trash Program' landing on Endless Hunger at the wrong time would ruin you.

11 Aug 2015 scd

Yeah, Overmind is going to be tough to work for me. I do like this Faust idea. I'm not sure I'll be using Clone Chip other than in emergencies, but if a single trash does land, that can be a disaster for the deck.