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I've been grinding jinteki.net over the past couple of weeks, and I think this list pushes Apex as far as he can go in the current Standard cardpool. Unfortunately, "as far as he can go" means losing 4-7 instead of 0-7, and still being locked out of too many games. However, I've discovered a lot of interesting things about Apex that make this list worth writing up. Shout-outs to the A.B.T.G, and to RIPApex on jinteki.net, for listening to all my my post-game reflections, and for their excellent advice.
"I have never seen Apex play Apocalypse and recover faster than the Corp." — RIPApex on jinteki.net
Everyone knows that the reason you play Apex is to get Apocalypse in-faction. Even the contrarian Chop Bot is a crutch list (the distant primary ancestor of this one) writes about un-cancelling the Apocalypse, and runs it at 3x. These people are wrong. You will not recover from an Apocalypse faster than the Corp, so don't even try. We are re-cancelling the Apocalypse! But then how do you use Apex's ability and cardpool?
First, Apex's ability. It has a few non-obvious uses beyond "fuel Prey/Heartbeat/Endless Hunger":
Now that the deck is on 1x Assimilator, I tend not to facedown cards until turn 3 or so, after I have an idea of what I need "now" vs "later". Useless duplicates (Dreamnet, Heartbeat, sometimes Reaver — see below) can obviously go facedown as soon as you see them.
Apex's faction cardpool scores 1/4 on the major components of a runner deck: money, draw, multi-access and icebreaking. The traditional Chop Bot/Wasteland/Reaver/Harbinger engine reduces Apex's ID ability to "when your turn begins, cycle 1 and maybe get some other stuff", and you whiff on finding the 3/45 Chop Bot 3000 depressingly often. (Seriously, check the Chop Bot is a crutch list for the GIF alone.) By the time you have your engine going, the Corp will be on game point anyway.
We need fast money to survive traces, and want to stay above 10 credits (among other reasons, it means you at least pass through a facechecked Whitespace):
We also need some drip economy to keep us afloat:
We need money more than we need draw, so there's no influence left to pull in any good draw Events. We make do with drip draw, and click-to-draw more often than we'd like:
"These are all really great ideas, and some very well thought out tricks, I mean that genuinely. I think Devil Charm is a bit influence heavy, but inspired with Prey." — RIPApex on jinteki.net
"Sometimes, the best thing to do with a deck is to shelve it." — A friend on A.B.T.G.
Every matchup is hard. You burn so many resources contesting remotes that you can't often check for Rashida Jaheems, so the Corp will accelerate to warp speed. Plus, it's hard to reliably get into centrals and stop either her or NGO Front from getting on the board. Here's how to lose a little less badly:
12 comments |
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3 Apr 2021
Ezaric
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3 Apr 2021
RepoRogue
Great writeup! I'm curious as to why you're only playing 1x Hunting Grounds. In the current meta, where Engram Flush is everywhere, it seems worth packing as a 2x. It would also seem to help with the NBN matchup. Outside of Apex, I can see it as a 1x since it's influence and most other factions don't get dumpstered quite so badly by NBN. |
3 Apr 2021
#endgame
For Apocalypse to be better in Apex, you need to a) make it easier to land, so you don't facedown so much stuff, or b) make it easier to recover from, so you can get accesses before the Corp recovers. Criminsls do a) so much better because that's their "thing", and Assimilator was an attempt to address b), but is ridiculously expensive. And you need to do it without making something that's imported by everyone else. Some ideas, off the top of my head:
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3 Apr 2021
#endgame
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3 Apr 2021
#endgame
I like Day[9]'s rule: suggsting a card is easy, suggesting a card and a cut is hard. Gachapon is fun card selection, but what would you remove to fit it in? Can you afford to be poorer, to have fewer tricks, or to give up multiaccess? What would you cut? Give it a spin and report back. |
3 Apr 2021
Bl4nk3t
Traditionally there have been two incompatible approaches to Apex, centered around the two most powerful pieces, the lovable devourer of worlds has to offer: Reaver and Apocalypse Beware though, as members of the cult could consider not playing a full set of either heresy - so a third copy of Reaver comes recommended - maybe at the cost of a cut copy of Reboot since this list seems to not depend too much on it. In the past, getting support to fire the good ol' 'lypse was actually quite easy coming at the cost of not wanting to suffer too much from it going off - but these days are gone. Even if you didn't recover as fast as the crop, it could sometimes feel like a "moral victory" to at least having "gotten the job done". It was the anarch faction approach to apex. The other "reaver shop 'light' style" might be the stronger option right now. I like your integration of the run based card support and the default of "use-Endless Hunger-to trash" stuff-plan!
Finally - don't forget to celebrate moral - if not actual victory in this style by "having gotten the job done" in the form of at least completing a powerful engine - the shaper faction approach to apex :) |
4 Apr 2021
#endgame
I suspect (Creative Commission, ?Reboot) -> 2x Career Fair will hurt the deck. We want real credits to trash assets, and only two of our resources cost ≥3 credits (Assimilator, and the one DreamNet we'll install). I see no other compelling economy events at 1 influence. I also think that you undervalue Reboot. There aren't many opportunities to get cards face-down until you have a draw engine going, so Rebooting reasonably early for five facedown cards is surprisingly useful. Even if they're events, they can help get you to a critical mass for Prey without Devil Charm, or keep Endless Hunger breaking. (And yes, Chop bot is a crutch ran both DDoS and Crowdfunding. Apex gets a lot better if you use broken cards.) |
4 Apr 2021
Murse
I've been long convinced that Apex is just on the cusp of decent. My own take netrunnerdb.com ran 3 copies of Logic bomb alongside boomerangs. With more playable neutral cards added and what I've learned here I may have to revisit Apex! Thanks! |
4 Apr 2021
#endgame
You're right that it makes Assimilator a lot more appealing, and Adam lists like recurring bombs with Reclaim. But as with anything Apex-related, we get the slow janky version. I'd love to hear how it goes, if you try it. |
22 Apr 2021
WillRufus
Hi, RIPApex here. I'd make some different choices, but I unfortunately agree with a lot of your assessment. Remember what I said about engines? Really good that you got as far as you did with it, I'll say again to these good people what I said to you. If decks were measured in time meant creating and tweaking them, Apex decks would never lose. Because you HAVE to spend that time to even play the game when you make it. It's a great playstyle that I adore, I've played it since the start of Kitara. I just wish it had been remotely playable without being the underdog over that time. |
As a newbie just getting into startup but hoping to try out Apex when I reach standard I was certainly disappointed to hear that the ID isn't very good, but I love to see people still trying to make it work! Apex is such a cool ID. Also the Devil Charm and Prey interaction is almost too spicy to handle. I love it. This is perhaps more of a card theory crafting question(from a noobs perspective)- But what do you think the Apex card pool needs to be able to leverage Apoc effectively? Thanks for the write up!